Lightning Round Challenge™: For some of the longer tenured rasslers on the WWE roster, what is the one angle that you can associate that them with and go “wow, someone was paid money to come up with this?” For a handful of those listed, I’m sure you could think of a dozen per person, but in this case, just the first one that pops to mind. As always, thanks for the years of entertainment and ripping apart those storylines to begin with. John Cena The Bray Wyatt feud. Made no sense, went nowhere, destroyed Bray as a main event guy. Kane Oh god, so many to choose from. Probably the one where he was fighting the fake version of himself because reasons. The Undertaker Speaking of fighting the fake version of yourself… Big Show Undertaker leaves him in the desert as training. Randy Orton Wasn’t the Hogan storyline pretty stupid? Triple H Katie Vick, boom. Goldust TAFKA Goldust in general. Which then leads to doomsday preacher Dustin Runnells and the return of the original Goldust character. So bad all around. Sting (got to get his name out there for potential Mania 32 rumors!) Black Scorpion, bitches.
Developmental of course has held the record for bad names lately, although to be fair they're more horribly generic than BAD, per se. Kwee Wee was absolutely awful, one of the worst. I think the worst by a country mile was WEE WILLIE WILKINS, but that was more of a specific rib by Dusty Rhodes rather than any kind of attempt at seriously naming someone. And I know others are not on my side on this one, but I always hated "X-Pac" as a name. Never worked for me and didn't really represent anything about the character.
I’m not sure how many people remember Herb Abrams, but he was probably the worst owner in professional wrestling to get a national TV deal (and PPV), with an eccentric personality (to say the least), a habitual liar, someone who constantly stiffed workers on pay, ordered Steve Williams to break another wrestlers nose for whatever personal issues he had with him, and eventually died wearing a diaper, covered in baby oil, and chasing hookers while high off his ass on coke… and yet, I don’t know if that’s enough to be worse than Dixie Carter.
Hi Scott As lists appear to be all the rage around here, I thought I’d send one for when you’re in a masochistic mood. What would you consider to be the best (or least horrible) match in the following categories: 1) Undertaker-Kane
4) Undertaker prior to 1996
5) Flair after 2001
6) Big Show
9) ‘Hollywood’ Hogan in WCW
12) Miz Cheers
Good morning, and welcome to Day 2 of the post-dated extravaganza. As you read this, it’s currently Victoria Day here in Canada, during which we celebrate the life and career of Lisa Varon. It’s a very specific stat holiday. OK, a list, that’s just terrific. Thanks heaps. 1. The first one at WM14 is still my favorite of a bad lot. 2. The Iron Man match, complete with Orton trying to murder Cena like a cartoon supervillain via exploding pyro table. It’s not a great match technically and fails on a lot of levels, but I can appreciate the sentiment. 3. The last man standing match they had at that PPV where HHH wrestled 14 times after Cena was injured. You know, that one. 4. I gotta go with him squashing the shit out of Jake Roberts at WM8. Really kicked off the babyface formula for him that worked incredibly well for years to come. I was about to throw Bret v. UT from Rumble 96 in your face, but then I realized you technically asked for “prior” to 96 and thus that one is just outside qualification. 5. The HHH cage match at Taboo Tuesday. 6. In general? He’s had some good matches. I’ll go with the stunningly great series against Lesnar in 2003, for example, when Show was wearing pants for some reason. Runner up would be his Hogan impression against Kurt Angle at Backlash 2000 for sheer entertainment value. 7. Kane’s also had his share of good matches. He was on a really impressive run from 2001-2004, in particular, before the unmasking. Discounting MITB and such, gotta go with the Kurt Angle miracle match featuring Mirror Universe Angle as my favorite. Close second would be the IC title match with Albert that almost hit **** somehow. 8. Now you’re just fucking with me. His initial series against Undertaker wasn’t terrible. 9. Probably one of the Flair matches, because Ric could get ***1/2 out of him in his sleep. The Luger title change on Nitro was hella-exciting but total horseshit as a match. 10. Street Fight with Shane at WM17! 11. Dusty actually had lots of great matches when he gave enough of a shit in the ring. Unfortunately by the time he was on the national stage with Crockett, that time had long passed. I’ve seen more than a few really good ones with Harley Race from the 70s in Florida, so I’d go with that. 12. Cena actually got a really good one out of him after their shit WM match, I think. I’ll go with the safe choice, however, and say the Daniel Bryan US title change match, unless someone can think of a really epic **** Miz singles match that I’m blocking out of my mind.
> Hey Scott,
> Someone wrote into the BoD recently, asking about some of the shittier PPVs on the Network that you could recall. By coincidence, that was my next project at Camel Clutch Blog, at least from the WWE side of things.
http://camelclutchblog.com/top-30-worst-wwe-pay-per-views-in-history/ Better you than me.
I always ask for you recommendations on what to watch and I realise I'm doing it wrong. What are the worst PPV shows you've ever endured during the last 10 years of WWE programming?
No Way Out 2002 and Bad Blood 2003 instantly jump out as being really bad shows with no redeeming qualities. Do you have any more that are worth flat out avoiding?
What are your most hated bad matches? What do you consider the most disastrous match of all time?
Not matches that were so bad they good, but just really poor, true trainwrecks. I’m talking:
Steiner v. Triple H / Triple H v. Hogan / Bret V. Vince / Bossman vs. Taker HIAC / The Shane vs. Kane vs. Testicles debacle / and so on.
Jason Bellomo writes:
fans talk about the WWE announce teams being subpar (which seems to be a
correct assessment, especially when comparing the current product with
the older stuff on the network). If you had your choice of anyone
(currently alive and well) to comprise the RAW and Smackdown announce
teams, who would you pick?
Sent from my iPad
Well Jason, I’ll respond to you with the team that really set the wrestling world on fire. The team that made wrestling feel legitimate in ways that are nearly impossible to describe, but also too countless to count.
I was reminded the other day that the KOTR 2001 main event was built around the tag champions Jericho and Benoit losing their belts to the Dudleyz and defending World Champion Austin getting into a two-week feud with Spike Dudley.
I'm sure there's a few CAN'T PUT CENA IN A VULNERABLE POSITION shows (like Cena vs. Miz I Quit, with Cena beating up Miz, Riley and Swagger in the same show) and the Survivor Series 2009 main event (that I think maybe got one week build).
Would be interested in your (and The Blog's) views.
Alright, buckos, here’s the question of the day.
What’s the worst sequel to a classic match? I’d have to say Rock vs Hogan II from No Way Out 2003. The original may not be a technical masterpiece, but the crowd & atmosphere is amongst the greatest of all time. It’s one of my all time favorite matches. However the sequel was absolute garbage. It was slow, immensely boring, The Rock not only phoned it in, be called collect. An absolute dud.
I’m sure some may say Hogan vs Warrior 2, but that match is bad in a fantastic way. I mean, the Log-Roll of Attempted Discomfort is worth the price of admission alone.
Legends of Wrestling Roundtable: Worst Characters
Gene Okerlund is your moderator and the panel is Mick Foley, Michael Hayes, Dusty Rhodes and Pat Patterson
This is the second episode with this group and the topic is one that should make for some entertaining discussion. Mick Foley throws down the first offender with Mantaur and he said it was the worst of a succession of a crap characters like Bastion Booger and this was during the time that Mick was trying to get into the WWF. And he then goes into a strange story about Shane Douglas pulling a prank on him calling his parents pretending to be Pat Patterson.
Michael Hayes says the most memorable debut of a character that seemed to have tons of potential but never had the second chance to make the first impression and it was the Shockmaster. Poor Fred Ottman.
(They show the infamous clip of the Shockmaster’s debut and of course it’s must-see TV for any fan of wrestling because the comedy that follows is off the charts. That and Davey Boy Smith’s ridiculous robe.)
Dusty tells the story and it’s hilarious. Apparently Ottman had busted through the gimmicked wall earlier in dress rehearsal for the segment but in between the dress and live TV David Crockett nailed a 2 x 4 to the wall that Dusty assumes was there to sabotoge him. Of course Ottman trips and his helmet rolls off (the image of him shaking the cobwebs out and then grabbing the helmet and putting it on is gutbusting). Dusty telling the story of Ottman’s reaction (“I really fucked this up didn’t I?”) is just amazing. I couldn’t stop laughing. They crack on the Gobbledy Gooker for a bit, poor Hector Guerrero. Dusty says he and Vince will discuss which idea was worse over drinks quite often. Dusty rehashes Davey Boy’s quote during the Shockmaster fracas too (“he fell on he ass didn’t he?”). Patterson quickly lets Vince fall on the sword the for Gobbledy Gooker idea.
Patterson switches to discuss the polka dots with Dusty and Dusty talks about adding Sapphire, who in his words had a worst body than he did. Mick asks if Dusty thought the polka dots was a humbling rib. Dusty said it probably was but he knew he could get it over. And Vince told him to enjoy his time in the WWF and for a year and a half he had a lot of fun and made a lot of money. Mick brings up the Mike Shaw characters from Makhan Singh to Norman to the shit he did in the WWF from The Monk to Bastion Booger. None of the characters took off and Shaw asked Patterson why he wasn’t getting many booking dates so Patterson told him to ask Vince. So poor Shaw waits and hour to see Vince and gets his release.
Okerlund talks about the thought that goes behind these characters and Mick makes a great point of understanding that Shockmaster might have something going for him upon his debut…but what possibly could the Gobbledy Gooker have going for it. Mick’s theory was that the Undertaker, who was released by WCW and debuting on this card, was supposed to bust through that egg. But once they saw how big and imposing Mr. McCool was they decided to go a different route (BTW at one point Hogan took full credit for all that from bring Mark in to see Vince and doing the whole gimmick). Patterson was also kept in the dark and actually thought it was Ric Flair. Dusty said the trick worked because Vince got people’s curiosity.
Terry Taylor said that the gimmick of The Red Rooster and Mr. Perfect were being batted around for him. Mick says Taylor could have been a great Mr. Perfect but Hayes disagrees and says would you rather hit a single with the gimmick or a home run. Hennig hit a home run. Hayes believes Taylor was talented enough to make anything work but he thought it was a rib and didn’t embrace it like Dusty embraced the polka dots. Okerlund says the gimmick was a damn chicken and Patterson has a line of a life time.
“What’s wrong with a cock in the ring.”
HOLY SHIT!! I am so happy I wasn’t drinking anything because the keyboard would have been destroyed.
(To back up Hayes, I take the character of Dolph Ziggler. That’s a stupid name and there’s no way a guy named Dolph Ziggler should get past the comedy stage. But god bless Nick Nemeth because he OWNS Dolph Ziggler. That is who he is and he is awesome. I say it again, 2013 has to be Dolph’s year. Beyond his exceptional talent in the ring he’s a damn smart guy that really seems to understand how to get a crowd going. And he made Amy Schumer beg for mercy when they were together, which is funny given her stand up routine and how she tortures guys in bed that can’t handle her.)
Hayes cracks on his own shitty WWF gimmick of Dok Hendrix and despite how stupid it was and how everyone knew who he was, he still had to try his best to make it work. Mick says there were some characters that thankfully were left on the cutting room floor. Vince asked him to be the Mutilator and of course we have Steve Austin’s wide assortment of name options like “Baron Von Ruthless”, “Ice Dagger” and “Chilly McFreeze (LOL)”. Duke Droese actually did a great Finkel impersonation and “announced” Austin as each of these names and Austin naturally thought they all sucked. Mick makes the point that no matter how talented you are, coming out to the ring as Ice Dagger and he’s dead.
Hayes talks about one of the great mistakes when Ole debuted Harlem Heat with Robert Fuller, doing his Colonel Sanders gimmick, and the Heat came out in chains. Hayes says Ole was obviously drunk when he thought of that (actually he’s just a racist fuckhead but we’ll hit on that in an episode down the road). Mick talks about how funny watching Ron Simmons come out as the Blue Sparticus and how he had to adjust the Faarooq gimmick. Patterson talks about his days as a stooge with Brisco and Hayes explains how the evening gown match came about. Well Hayes and Brian Gerwitz needed one more match for this PPV (someone fill me in on which PPV this was) and Hayes said that a Trish-Lita bra & panties match was the clear leader in the clubhouse. But Vince wanted something with the stooges for the Hardcore title. Hayes tried to reason with Vince and say…would you rather see Trish in a bra or the stooges in a brawl and Vince gives the classic open-ended answer “You’re right!” and you see what we got.
Conversation shifts to gimmicks that appeared to be bad on the surface but worked. Hayes said the first one that comes to mind is Goldust. Dusty explains how the “real stooge” Bruce Pritchard set all this up. Dusty says the Goldust entrance was the best in the wrestling at the time. He took that gimmick to the point of where it became his alter ego and and it was very revolutionary. Dusty doesn’t believe it was a rib but rather they wanted to go with something outlandish. Hayes says at first Scott Hall refused to work with him but relented later.
(Clips of Goldust’s early interviews and in my opinion hindsight has helped that character a ton because it was really something unique and different and Dustin did a hell of a job.)
They talk about the evolution of Scott Hall from Starship Coyote to Razor Ramon and Steve Austin from Stunning to Stone Cold. Dusty and Hayes said those characters were in those guys from the beginning and they had it in their hearts and the crowd responded. Hayes says Foley did as well with Cactus Jack and Dude Love. Patterson talks about how much fun George Steele had with his character.
(Clips of Steele and Lou Albino doing shock therapy on Tuesday Night Titans. Steele gets shocked and of course speaks like a professor before getting re-shocked and turning back into the animal. Oddly enough I think George Steele is or was a public school teacher. Funny stuff.)
They talk about Doink and Foley talks about how great Matt Borne was at it and how others just couldn’t compare. Patterson says there was tons of Doinks but Borne made it work because he was a little demented. Okerlund talks to Patterson about being part of the think tank to come up with these guys and Patterson says the key is to live the character. Mick talks about guys that keep their characters and make it work everywhere is Abdullah the Butcher, who hops from country to country and has been the same guy forever. And he compares that to a guy that’s in one place like the Undertaker and is forced to constantly evolve his character and that’s how he’s stayed in the industry. Same with Triple H, how he evolved from the blue blood, to DX to the Game. Hayes says it’s passion and the desire to get that crowd going above all others.
Dusty blames El Gigante/Giant Gonzalez on Jim Herd and Hayes mentions the Ding Dongs. Dusty says even strong characters have bad moments and Dusty talks about the Terrordome match at 1991 Halloween Havoc and how fucked up that was. They then crack on Mick’s issues with lighting stuff on fire. Hayes talks about his own bad moment when he and Jimmy Garvin were doing a new Freebird song called “I’m a Freebird what’s your excuse” and relays a story of how WCW screwed up the audio and cracks on Garvin not knowing the lyrics anyway. Hayes is singing and Jimmy is reading his lips but there’s no audio and it was a disaster in the live audience. Luckily they had studio rehearsal footage to go to.
(They show clips of this abomination and it’s as bad…hell it’s much worse than Hayes describes. Garvin’s lip synching is Volkoff quality bad. The clip goes on a little too long though.)
Patterson talks about being on a European tour and the promoter in the final show did a horrible job and it was a bad crowd so Patterson decides to have fun and switch up the theme musics. Bret Hart comes out to pomp and circumstance, etc.
The Bottom Line: Tremendous stuff from the guys for the most part but it tailed off after 45 minutes.