Hi Scott,

So I see that there is major plans to push Samoa Joe coming to this WM, which makes me ask, as I have for over a decade now, WTF!

Over all the upcoming WWE roster, Joe is the only one who’s been money for years now. He’s an imposing figure who looks like he could stand toe-to-toe with anyone from any era. He can wrestling every style possible and he’s as good a promo as your likely to find.

Why have they been passing this long on a guy?

What’s the link I’m looking for here…?

Oh yeah, that’s the one!

  • The reality is (and I know this is going to get me heat), Joe isn’t a star. When Joe was in his prime and tearing shit up in ROH/TNA, WWE was still in that bodybuilder/college athlete phase where they didn’t want to hire guys from the indies, they wanted homegrown talents they could mold into TV stars. Somewhere along the way (when all of their real stars started retiring and/or quitting the promotion), they decided to start giving indy guys a chance, which is a fine idea in theory, but they’ve gone too far with it. RAW has become Ring of Honor on steroids, and the ratings have been plummeting because there are no stars anymore. The casual TV viewers are not going to be hooked by guys who look like Joe, owens, Zayn, etc.

    TL;DR version: Joe is only getting called up now because there are no real stars left.

    • justicegris

      I agree with you totally.

    • cabspaintedyellow

      I miss characters who didn’t have real names. Their name was just their character.

      Like, why does Elias Samson need the name Elias Samson? Why can’t he just be The Drifter?

      If he came in today, The Undertaker would be Killian Eldridge or some shit.

      • itwastyped

        I don’t know if you know this but they literally named a new NXT wrestler “Killian Dain” this week

        • cabspaintedyellow

          …….the fuck.

        • I wonder if that’s a Jessica Jones reference. Not quite Kilgrave but it sounds close.

      • To be fair, Undertaker was called ‘Kane the Undertaker’ for his first few appearances. Just be glad his last name was “Killjoy”.

      • spicollidriver

        wouldn’t Samoa Joe at least be kind of going in that direction? (“CM Punk” would be something similar) I mean, obviously that’s not a “real” name.

      • Daniel Swinney

        I have basically the opposite opinion. The only guys I don’t want to have real names (or “real” “names” like Finn Balor) are monster characters like Undertaker, and guys who wear masks. That said, I’m used to “Samoa Joe” so that’s fine.

        Also I want every women’s wrestler to have a last name, except maybe Bayley.

    • dirtyearsbill

      Who would you spotlight instead of the top guys being used right now?

      • I don’t think they have the right players on the roster right now. But given what they have: Reigns, Rollins, Nakamura, Bayley, and Balor would be the core group I build around. I realize Reigns and Rollins are already being used in top positions, but they are getting booked like shit. They have star potential though.

        • Oh, and Braun Strowman too. Seriously.

        • Empian

          Not AJ? I agree that Reigns and Rollins are stars. Reigns is just badly miscast and Rollins booking is some of the worst I’ve ever seen.

          • I have nothing against AJ, and I’m fine with him being in a Triple H “guy who works with the guy who draws the money” role, but I don’t see big money in AJ independently. I think had he come around 10 years earlier, sure. But he’s a bit long in the tooth to invest in at that level.

    • jimmybell

      Nobody’s a star because WWE doesn’t really book any regular as a star. And they’ve chased off a lot of the audience via the following:

      First they told fans that what happens at house shows doesn’t matter, the really important stuff happens on TV and PPVs.

      Then they told fans that what happens during their 5 hours of weekly television doesn’t matter, the only important stuff happens on PPV/Network Special.

      Then they told fans that what happens on PPV/Network Specials doesn’t matter, the only really important stuff happens at Wrestlemania.

      Then (this year especially) they told fans that what happens at Wrestlemania doesn’t really matter either.

      Who’s going to bother watching hours of weekly tv when you can just tune in to a monthly special (or just during Wrestlemania season) because that’s where the story progression and big matches actually happen, sometimes.

      I’m pretty sure that the current booking team could have peak Hogan, Sting, Flair, Austin, whoever you’re willing to call a star, and Raw ratings would still be bad and everybody would be talking about how they can’t draw. They just have no idea how to book a weekly 3 hour show and keep people interested in the stories.

      • This is absolutely true. I don’t disagree with any of this. But at least they’ve had a fighting chance with peak Hogan, Austin, Rock, etc. Expecting casual viewers to tune in every week for Kevin Owens and Sami Zayn is a Hail Mary at best, and suicide at worst.

        • People will tune in if they connect with the wrestlers. Random point but people are in relationships not because they don’t have weaknesses, but because they have presented themselves and connected somehow.

          Mysterio was the opposite of Hogan but was presented in a way that could draw, and he definitely did. Didn’t matter he was 4′ tall. Owens and Zayn (and a LOT of guys) are not there yet, whoever’s fault it is

          • I would argue there is still a pretty wide gap between a Rey Mysterio and an Owens/Zayn in terms of star quality. The mask, the exciting high flying style, his charisma, etc. He was very marketable. In fact, his size was an asset to his marketability. He looked like a Superhero, but he was small enough that little kids could live through him vicariously. I agree with your overall point though.

    • Robinson Tilapia

      Joe’s an ass-kicker who can convincingly work, cut a solid promo, and act a solid foil for several acts on the roster right now. At his age, he’s clearly going to get over in order to get other guys over, but it is what it is.

      A Joe/Reigns series might actually be helpful to Reigns as a worker. There are other pairings that would work well.

      Joe the Headliner obviously isn’t going to happen, but Joe as someone who can help those around him absolutely can happen.

      • I’m not saying Joe can’t be a valued member of the roster. But this idea that Joe is going to show up and win the Rumble and headline Mania, etc. Why? He’s not somebody who is going to significantly move the needle. Why invest that kind of push in somebody like him?

        • Robinson Tilapia

          I don’t think he’s going to either, but I think there is a lot of value in him on the main roster.

          • I’m responding to these rumors that Joe is being slotted for a “top Mania match.” That seems short-sighted, in my view.

          • Robinson Tilapia

            Eh. There are going to be a lot of “top Mania matches.” You could program him with Reigns in a “Imma gon beat the Samoan into you” feud, and have that be the launch of it. Won’t be the main event, but would still be an important match.

      • Got Luger’d

        What do you mean Joe a headliner is obviously not going to happen? Styles is older, has taken a lot more bumps and is a headliner so I fail to see why Joe can’t sustain a main event push.

        • Robinson Tilapia

          Styles’s peak, prior to coming to the WWE, is a hell of a lot higher than Joe’s ever was.

          • Got Luger’d

            See, now that’s just subjective. Joe has ability as you mentioned and there’s no indication he can’t perform as a headliner but I’m being subjective as well. Clearly, based on the reports, they feel he’s worthy of that kind of treatment.

          • Robinson Tilapia

            Sure. He could certainly catch fire. I’ll give you that.

            I just think the more likely role will be as an important cog, but one that’s used to get other top guys over.

  • itwastyped

    Take him out of NXT early and what’s your main event? Shinsuke Vs The Drifter? Now that Bobby Roode’s on that level, they can afford to move Joe to WWE. Personally I’m not a big fan of the guy, find him kinda boring, but I see the appeal

    • I love NXT but there is a SERIOUS lack of star power on the main roster. If there are people who connecting in NXT (for any reason) they need to fast track them to the main roster and make them big deals.

      NXT will be fine with Riddick Moss powerslamming Hideo on his head in the main event every night; the main roster needs the most over acts NOW.

      • itwastyped

        Why don’t they make big deals out of the wrestlers they’ve already got? The reason WWE is the shits right now isn’t because Samoa Joe hasn’t been called up

        • The main reasons WWE is sucking isn’t only a lack of new faces but it is a big factor. Many of the main roster guys are too long in the tooth, have been pushed/de-pushed too many times and the larger audience will not bite on them anymore. Case in point: Dolph Ziggler.

          Even if the writing doesn’t change on iota, fresh faces on the show gives people fresh hope.

    • JimbobJones

      I think them focusing on NXT while their main roster suffers is idiotic. It would have been like them having all of their top stars held down in OVW a few years back. They’ve gotten enough praise on NXT that they forgot what it’s supposed to be.

      Their most over wrestler right now is the only one in recent memory (besides Strowman) to come directly to the main roster. Imagine how much impact Joe would have had if he’d just shown up on Raw or on Smackdown. Now that he’s been trudging around in NXT for so long, they can’t easily bring him in as a “main event player” because “he just came from development, so he can’t be brought in at the top”

      • itwastyped

        The reason there’s a lack of star power on the main roster isn’t because all the big stars are in NXT, it’s because the writing is bad and they don’t create new stars as a result. Joe and Nakamura aren’t going to solve their problems, they need a better quality product

        • JimbobJones

          I agree with you, of course. But leaving big stars in NXT just exacerbates the problem.

  • Jeremy Rinehart

    Joe & AJ vs. American Alpha would be a hell of a match at WrestleMania

  • hhcates

    “He’s fat…HE’S FAT!”

    In our 5-second GIF and soundbite era, how much bigger of a star would Scott Steiner be if he debuted now?

    • Night

      Oh, he’s getting slapped by Stephanie a kajillion times every time he gets over the slightest.

      • RawisStoned

        Of course if they tried that on live TV Big Pappa Pump might just slap her back

        • Steiner’s the only guy who when I watch, I feel like someone forgot to tell him ‘dude, chill out, wrestling’s fake.’

          • The Great American Beard

            Bret Hart on line 1.

        • Got Luger’d

          No, he’d just grab her by the pussy and make HHH his bitch until real police officers come in and actually arrest him.

  • RawisStoned

    I will never get tired of seeing that.

  • Got Luger’d

    Wow, am I the only Joe fan here? What’s with the negativity or blase attitude about a Joe push here?

    • RawisStoned


    • Joe’s on the decline but he’s great. There’s just zero faith in Vince and the main roster writers to use him effectively. Given their track record, they deserve every inch of that doubt.

      • Got Luger’d

        You sure he’s on the decline? He’s slightly younger than AJ and has taken less bumps than him yet AJ still looks like a million bucks out there.

        • AJ has adjusted his style so while he plays entirely different to prime AJ, he is a master of timing and selling. Like a late-era HBK.

          Joe hasn’t changed much of his moves or his approach to matches (he’s still doing the same combos from over a decade ago), so it’s more obvious he can’t put in the same snap or speed in. Like a late-era HHH. That’s all I mean, he’s still a can’t miss worker.

          Oh, but those Nakamura matches never left 2nd gear. I can never rewatch them

          • Got Luger’d

            Good point. Still, I believe Joe will be motivated to adjust and tinker as well, though. We’ll see.

    • PatJames387

      Joe is by far my favorite wrestler in WWE right now… Been a fan of him since his ROH days.

    • Manjiimortal

      It’s a running gag, and perhaps (more worryingly) a sign of the waste of a decade that was his career in TNA, when you reduce him to Steiner calling him fat and the insane and amazing math promo.

    • Daniel Swinney

      The BoD commentariat has a “let’s not overrate indy/workrate heroes” element. I think sometimes that crosses over into “let’s start actively underrating guys to counteract the level of love they’ve always gotten.”

    • Mike Mears

      You’re not alone. Joe’s awesome and always has been.

    • PhilStubington

      You’re not the only one. Some of us who actually watch NXT (as opposed to just saying it’s sucked ever since Ryan whatshisname left) were raving about Joe’s promo work building up the feud with Nak. Sadly the matches underwhelmed, but then I’ve never seen what the fuss is about Nak in the ring.

  • RG-Dallas

    Scott Steiner needs to continue managing Shoney’s.

    • RawisStoned

      To his credit when they interviewed him that one time he seemed somewhat normal. Leads me to believe he only unleashes the crazy when in character

      • Got Luger’d

        No, it’s called being off the juice.

  • Samosa Joe, am I right?

  • in fairness he is pretty fat and it’s hard to push someone that fat. They just don’t budge easily

  • Kanye Batista

    God damn I love Scott Steiner!

  • HartKiller_09

    I wouldn’t go as far as to call the brother fat. What’s he gonna do about it? He’s Samoan.

  • Got Luger’d

    So, what are the odds Joe wins the Rumble, using Steiner’s Theory of Percentages?

  • Manjiimortal

    It was his sled…

  • Buster Abbott

    This may sound like splitting hairs, but I always saw Joe as ‘big’ rather than ‘fat.’ Despite being a large guy, he doesn’t really look out of shape.

    He also actually looks tough, and that innate “wow, this guy looks like bad news” vibe is missing from a lot of the main roster right now.

    • spicollidriver

      that last part btw is what I like about Kevin Owens. in contrast to a lot of people on the roster, at least to me he looks like “a guy that could beat you up” (and I don’t just mean his (literal) look, more the way he “carries himself”).

    • Chopper

      I saw him before a local indy show about ten years ago. He was just walking around by the merch tables and had on a sweatshirt and shorts and looked like a chubby kid who couldn’t hurt anyone. It was a different story when he was in the ring, because he does turn it on to be a convincing badass, but at first glance he is not an impressive looking guy.

  • ONITA100

    I still don’t understand how they didn’t all break character and lose it. No way I couldn’t

    • Got Luger’d

      Because they were all fucking terrified of Steiner and didn’t want him to be like Joe Pesci in Goodfellas and ask them what’s so funny.

  • HartKiller_09

    Joe gives Stephanie a foot massage, Triple H doesn’t like it, boom, Wrestlemania feud. This stuff writes itself.

  • Even at his peak, Joe has always looked like he’s wrestling in slow motion or underwater to me. How much I enjoy a match of his is based directly on who else he’s in the ring with.

  • “He’s fat!” Is one of my all time favorite things ever in wrestling.

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